Empowering Families with Jean Ross, Care Coordinator turned Tech CEO
CareCraft sat down with Jean Ross, a former critical care nurse who transitioned into entrepreneurship to change the way we approach care coordination for aging adults. From her experiences in the ICU to founding her first company in care coordination to pivoting during the COVID pandemic and launching a tech company, Jean shares her insights, challenges, and triumphs in navigating the complex world of healthcare.
Key Points:
The Catalyst for Change: Jean shares her personal motivations for for improving healthcare transitions and supporting families.
Founding KayBee: Learn how Jean navigated the first few years of running her care coordination company, establishing relationships in the community, and expanding her practice. Discover the challenges she faced and the innovative solutions she implemented to bridge the gap between hospital care and home health for aging adults.
Looking Ahead: As Jean embarks on her latest venture, Primary Record, she discusses her vision for the future of healthcare technology and the role it plays in empowering families to manage and share health data securely. Gain insight into the innovative solutions Primary Record offers and the impact it aims to make on the healthcare landscape.
Join us for an inspiring conversation with Jean as we explore her remarkable journey from critical care nurse to healthcare entrepreneur, and discover the transformative power of compassion, innovation, and partnership in shaping the future of patient care.
Episode Link: Spotify
Resources Mentioned:
Transcript
[00:00:04] Ariadne: Hi, welcome to CareCraft. I'm here today with Jean, a nurse by training. She left critical care in 2015 to focus on transitions in care for seniors. She then founded her first company, KayBee, a membership based care coordination organization focused on supporting aging adults in Indiana. And after running KayBee for six years, Jean has co founded a technology company called Primary Record, which is designed for families to have one secure place to organize, collaborate, and share health data, bringing together invaluable information scattered across patient portals, three ring binders, and post it notes.
[00:00:37] Thank you so much for joining us today, Jean. How are you doing?
[00:00:41] Jean: Oh, thank you so much. It's morning. We're drinking coffee and waking up. This is going to be a great conversation.
[00:00:46] Ariadne: I'm so excited for it. First, I always like to start with, there's a lot of different names for the work that care managers or care coordinators do, you know, a care navigator, patient advocate, health coach, et cetera.
[00:00:57] How do you distinguish between those titles? And is there one in particular you prefer to use?
[00:01:04] Jean: Yes. So actually that was a funny thing because when I started KayBee, I just, I wanted to coordinate care. So I kept calling myself a care coordinator, but then soon I realized most people were referring to me as a care manager and that's when I started realizing like, No wonder why this is so confusing for families. What are you trying to hire? You know, a care navigator, a patient advocate, a care coordinator. So for me though, I just, I was always so stubborn. I wanted to be called a care coordinator because for me it was very much a partnership with that family swooping in and coordinating the services
[00:01:39] And it almost implies like a, you know, Not a long term solution, right? It's just someone to kind of help get things in a better direction and get that family you know, in a better spot and then going on to the next. So that was so yeah, so I always referred myself as a care coordinator
[00:01:53] Ariadne: that's awesome. And now you're a two time founder. I wanted to focus first, actually, on your experience founding KayBee. And you know, what were you doing before you founded that organization and how did you end up in the industry?
[00:02:07] Jean: Yeah, so I was a second degree nurse and fell in love with critical care.
[00:02:11] I always called myself a little bit of an adrenaline junkie. I liked chaos. I liked swooping in and getting things organized and, and really the, almost the one on one care and critical care, really focusing on a patient and during a situation that's, you know, very scary and overwhelming and making it better.
[00:02:27] I did that for six years. But what I kept running into was 80 plus year olds and family caregivers. I was a night shift nurse. So that's often when family could come after work and come visit and just listening to their stories for six years. I kept wondering myself, like, why does someone over 80 feel like they need the ICU?
[00:02:45] This seems like the worst place to bring someone older. I mean, it's needed at times, but for the most part just really had this question of like, what's happening out in the community. Or what could nurses do to impact? So maybe families felt like they had different options or, or choices or, or could understand what was happening.
[00:03:03] And I kind of kicked that around. I know many nurses have this idea they wanna go start because they see a better way of doing something. For me, the catalyst was actually having an aunt, and that's what KayBee was named after. Her name was Kay Beson. She had undergone a major surgery. Her and I were going back and forth over email, all the questions she had, you know, and, and she had this, a lot of concern around Coumadin cause it's a scary drug.
[00:03:26] And she had acute episode where there was like four different doctors involved. One made a decision that wasn't on her care team where it held the Coumadin that never got communicated back. And so she developed a blood clot, you know, and, and I wasn't aware her, she just had a pain in her leg and he massaged it.
[00:03:43] And that ultimately left, led to a clot in her lungs that took her life and seeing that and that just kind of was the spark that led me to be like, families need better support. Like there's, she had this wonderful family around her and why don't they have the knowledge or awareness of making sure their doctors are on the same page because we just assume they are, but they're not.
[00:04:06] And so that's what really spurred me to go figure it out. I remember going on Squarespace and making a website and it's scary. Like, and then you, you think, Oh my gosh, I'm gonna get so many clients. And then you realize, Oh my gosh, I gotta. You got to let people know what you're doing and you have to figure out where your source is coming from.
[00:04:23] And what are you doing? Are you coordinating? Are you care managing? Are you, you know, like, are you there's being an advocate. So there's a lot to figure out. And for me, it was building I spent almost a year just talking to all the different businesses in my community. Realizing, There's a ton and they can't find the families and the families can't find them.
[00:04:43] So we really served our role as a coordinator and swooping and really understand what was happening in the gaps and then building a better team around that home. And then being a point of contact for that family and those businesses to make sure care was done the right way.
[00:04:56] Ariadne: I'm interested on that day zero experience when you were like, I'm going to take the leap, like, what did that look like?
[00:05:03] Jean: I think my first client was from my mom, you know. And, and then you kind of realize, like, how do you find people?
[00:05:10] How do you find people to help? Like you have this wonderful skillset and knowledge. And that's when I started honestly, I started volunteering a lot. I ended up actually becoming a, an advocate and a guardianship program. So I could start understanding the care system better out in the community.
[00:05:26] I started at the time we were just starting at a grassroots movement in Indiana called Dementia Friends. So I got involved with that and that just started opening the doors. To people one, knowing who I am and two being able to talk about I'm a volunteer in this space, but this is also something I'm trying to provide out in the community.
[00:05:43] And just kept showing up to tables, even if I wasn't invited to learn and ask questions and see how I could help. And, and that was exhausting because you're trying to do that on top of, you know, when you start do getting those clients trickling in, managing it, creating your workflows. Oh my gosh, do I need an EMR now?
[00:06:00] Like It's overwhelming, but like, it's super fun in the same guard because you're just figuring out as you go.
[00:06:06] Ariadne: That's awesome. I actually saw on your website, well, I know that you're no longer running KayBee, but it's still operational. That it is actually like a membership based organization, which is not something I've seen a lot of other independent care managers do.
[00:06:19] So I was curious, like, was that always the plan from the beginning or how did that evolve?
[00:06:24] Jean: No pricing is probably the hardest thing and the hardest thing for independent, you know, advocates and whatnot. Like, how do you ask for money for the services that you're doing? When I first started I looked at what are other care managers, care coordinators, care navigators, advocates doing?
[00:06:39] And it was around that hourly rate, but I just kept hearing from my clients, like, It is kind of overwhelming because you don't know how many hours it's going to take and whatnot, but I still needed that, that information. So I kept that for a while until I could see a pattern of like, okay, a new client takes this many hours to onboard.
[00:06:57] You know, if they have this kind of profile of like, you know, different conditions, this is how many hours we typically are called upon. So then I could kind of guess at a rate of You know, what, what would be a monthly and that just kind of made my family's more at ease, you know, and always this option for additional consulting or whatnot, but just could offer more of a package and try to figure out what that is, but that took a lot of time.
[00:07:20] And then I know Ashley has taken it on to she actually coordinates care for some dementia group homes. So like she's found some other opportunities and, and works with them and partners with a couple other organizations. I always tell her she's a much better business woman than I am and what she's been able to do with KayBee.
[00:07:35] Ariadne: How long were you operating KayBee before you felt like you hit your stride or? You know, was that always something new to learn?
[00:07:43] Jean: Oh, I don't know if you ever, when you're leading something, you never feel like you're in your stride. But in the reflection of looking back I would say it probably took me a good year to understand one, that my customer wasn't the older adult.
[00:07:57] It was the children supporting those older adults. So it kind of then made me learn how to find clients. And then, then that second year was a lot as, as I started getting increasing a number of clients, it was like, I need a process, right? I need, you know, it needs to be comforting and, and uniform because I started eyeballing, like, I want to bring other nurses into this.
[00:08:18] they are not in my brain, you know, they don't know how I onboard or the questions I ask and, and the assessments we do. So that second year took a lot of documenting and then third was in starting to find nurses and, and piecing it together. So probably by year four, I felt like I hit my stride.
[00:08:34] And then that was also the timing of, you know, I had done so much work in my community. And so people then started knowing about who I was and, and it was, it was very neat. And actually the story of it is I never intended to start a technology company. I actually had nine nurses and we were ready.
[00:08:49] I was, I had a whole plan and I, we had this like fun lunch and then I was ready to get them onboarded and going with their own clients. And that was February of 2020. So when March hit. We were scared to go visit older adults in their homes and older adults were scared to go out of their homes. So I had to turn to those nurses and be like, I don't know what's going to happen, but, you know, I don't want you to put your life on hold because we have no idea where this is going.
[00:09:15] But then there was a ton of reflection afterwards about the value that we were providing as nurses in that home for that family. And that's what sort of then was the napkin of what could, what could else we could do. And that's where Primary Records emerged.
[00:09:28] Ariadne: Tell us more about what exactly Primary Record does and how you did make that transition from leading your own care management organization to now a technology company.
[00:09:39] Jean: Yeah. And I'm not gracefully. It was not done gracefully. But the, the, the piece that I kept being frustrated about when I was running that care coordination piece There was just so much time to get up to speed of who that person is. And it was also an awareness that when I walked into a home, families knew at a high, Some level what was happening but, and for, for nurses, we want all the details because to advocate the best, to find the best resource, we kind of had to have the whole picture.
[00:10:10] And so, I mean, for us, like when I would look at like the scalability of our idea, cause I got approached a lot about, you know, how do you scale this? But the biggest barrier for our team was it would take 10 to 20 hours. To like understand what someone's medical story was so that we could figure out those services and the things and then, and then the upkeep, I mean like charging families, you know, it was time consuming because there's just so many things changing and so many doctors to communicate to.
[00:10:38] So that is the biggest reflection period that I had. And and, and I was like. I want people that want to do this work, that to be removed so that they can help families in a quicker and more efficient way. And at that time, I had done a ton of policy work, and there is this new law called the 21st Century Cures Act.
[00:10:59] And there, and written in there, is patient access to electronic data. And I think that is awesome, but at the same time, if you dump data, All the data out of a patient portal to a family. They don't know what to do with it. They don't know what it means sometimes. And so that has been the three years of, of trying to figure out how do you simplify health information?
[00:11:20] How, then once you have the information, how do you make it actionable for that family to use it in a way so they can get better care? And then my dream is how do you then partner with a family? with those nurses and those social workers and those that need that information in a quick way and a digestible way to better help that family.
[00:11:39] And so we're really trying to build that partnership out in our community between the families and those services to figure out how we get better care because everything is heading towards out of the hospital, but we haven't figured out a good way. And nobody seems to want to partner with the patient and the family caregivers, social workers and nurses.
[00:11:55] So.
[00:11:58] Ariadne: Yeah, it's a really interesting approach. Where are you as a company, like, do you have like a product that's out there and people can go download or it's still in development?
[00:12:09] Jean: Yes. So we've we've, we've been through like two betas and we just went live to like our wait list of families and, and smattering stuff, like very organic right now.
[00:12:19] So we went live in December of 2023. So today you technically could go on our website at primaryrecord.com and you could, you know, sign up and see what the heck this does. We have been what we realized when we were helping families integrate all their patient portals in one place. We started seeing the gaps, and that's when we've been the past three months doing a ton of research and development around how do you let them upload those pieces of paper and then search and find them and make many of them.
[00:12:49] How do you use AI? To better search and find answers. And so we are kind of finally putting a pause and all that. I always tell people when you come into my app, it's like the wild, wild west because there's like no onboarding experience. It's all functional. But now in April, we are actually opening our doors to families.
[00:13:08] Anyone that wants to try us, because we see, you know, We only get better with families telling us what they need, and because this is a tool for them. So for April and May, anyone signing up will have a free premium family subscription all the way through the end of the year so that we can partner with our families and learn how best to get them engaged and using this information to, to take better care.
[00:13:27] So we are very much in the, like I'm not sleeping. I'm working like 50 hours, you know, every day it feels like to try to get this figured out because this is the passion of mine. Like I, I, we need information in family's hands and we need to be taking better care. Like, I don't think our system is sustainable how it is with how we're aging and our you know, our care, our families are trying to take and support the aging adults.
[00:13:49] So there's, there's a lot of work to do. So I'm very grateful for your platform too, because the care management side of it is so critical.
[00:13:56] Ariadne: That sounds like it's quite the roller coaster ride you're on right now. So just the person that is using it. Is it normally like the older adults like in a care management situation?
[00:14:08] Or would it be the adult child on behalf of their parents? Or how have you envisioned that or seen it being used today?
[00:14:14] Jean: So, you know cause something, so my business partner is actually my neighbor. So when I had that whole like March, 2020 episode, you know, like I walked across, this was like in July when we were, we knew we were a little safer to get out of our houses.
[00:14:26] And you know, cause my whole energy was around older adults. But my business partner has a daughter with Down Syndrome. And so the thing that I started realizing is like, this isn't, it can't just be about the one person we're taking care of. Really, honestly, when you look at the person that's often the primary organizer or the caregiver in their family, they're often managing an older adult.
[00:14:46] They have a spouse they're trying to keep on healthy and they have their kids. And so we have a very family centered platform where, you know, as me going in and signing up, I can get my kids in there and can get their patient portal signed up. I can send a code to my parents or I can kind of like work with them.
[00:15:04] And then we have a whole share model so that families then can control, you know, my dad started his primary record. Cause you know, his daughter owns this, so he has to do it. And then he can invite me in as his daughter to see his information and help partner with him. But we also have families that their parents don't want anything to do with technology.
[00:15:22] And so they let, you know, get their permission to get one started and, and be able to manage and then invite in those siblings and those family members that are all worried and trying hard to make sure that their family member stays okay. Cause I think the family is kind of that last mile. We need to figure out how to reach and connect.
[00:15:37] Because what I saw as a nurse is you have that medically complex person in their home. They're not the one making the appointments, figuring out transportation, getting the services in the home. Like you have to figure out a way to engage those people that care about that person. If we really want to impact taking care of our, our medically complex folks in the, in the community.
[00:15:56] So but yeah, so very family centered you know, it's, it can be, you know, we, we actually have these fun labels. Not labels like personas, like where we call it a firstborn Franny. She's the take charge daughter, you know, that like that is, you know, taking care of mom and dad. But then, you know, he's also got, you know, kids and she's on a million different committees at her school.
[00:16:16] And then you've got we call it medical mama, Mary. So these are the amazing, amazing moms who have kids that are faced with Things that just put me in tears most times, but have to manage going to multiple hospitals just to get care for their kid in the right way. And then we have our, our advocate, Ashley's, and these are our folks that are, are starting you know, trying to support families and, and help them understand the information.
[00:16:39] So those are kind of our three people that we work with today and, and are just excited to, to see where, what we learned from them and, and how we can do better.
[00:16:48] Ariadne: What's that experience been like in terms of like helping synthesize all that data? Cause you know, I, I mean, it's a lot for someone with a clinical background like, like the nurse or social worker, but now putting it in the hands of the family, like, how do you make it not feel overwhelming?
[00:17:04] Jean: I don't know if we've figured that out quite yet. But because the first thing is, you know, the fact that we let you connect as many portals as possible. So our first thing that we had to do, because if you, as you know, people just repeat and re enter information. So we had to first learn how we call deduplication.
[00:17:19] So we have to first, like, families need to see one, you know, medication and then the many instances around that. And so that was kind of the, the first hurdle. And then we l learned that a lot of data that comes over. So your electronic health record is only updated when you're visiting. Your doctor, right?
[00:17:36] And so many families are like, this is all, I don't take that anymore. I don't have that condition anymore. So we had to put in their hands, the power to bulk edit and quickly get things updated in their own way. And then we have this whole, like, so my husband's an emergency physician, cause we have this whole share model.
[00:17:51] So you can invite family members in, but they still need to communicate to their providers and healthcare team. And the health care system is not ready for us to fight feed patient generated data in yet we're built to and designed. So when they're ready that can happen. So today though, we allow what I call my easy buttons.
[00:18:08] And so you have medication list, you hit a button, you've updated and have kept your primary record updated. We will print out a medication list for that family. That they can share with the caregiver, with the, you know, the, the going to a new doctor and that is designed, we call the Dr. Chris Ross test any report that we're generating, we hand it to him.
[00:18:27] And if he says, I'll never look at it, then we go back and we iterate. Because my magical moment I want for families is they get the, they hand something to a doctor and they're like, where did you get this? Like, that's what I want for them. I want to be the, the ability to synthesize that data and through the nurse and doctor brains that we've got on our team and make sure that what they're putting in that doctor's hands is useful for them to get the better care.
[00:18:49] And then last we cause the world is all around AI and whatnot, and we just have some. We have actually our two engineers are brothers, we're very family centered company. And when Connor kind of brought up, you know, like he'd love to geek out on this. I'm like, all right, go to town. And it's been phenomenal.
[00:19:07] And so that ability, like the. Cause the firstborn Frannie, there's a lot of control because often it's in her head and it's hard to get help or another sibling to take someone, because if there's a question, you know, who's going to answer it. So now that ability to have information in one place, now you ask questions and anyone taking that person can find the answer.
[00:19:27] So like, when was your last EEG? When was your last medication? What has changed in your medications? Now we allow families to put that question in. So. And then generate the answer to be able to relay to the care team. So those are like the things that we are really excited to bring more families in because we've just got the, into the application, but we have to test it.
[00:19:46] We have to make sure that it's saying the right thing and that it's equitable and it's giving the, an answer that, you know, works for any family of any race or economic status. So that's, those are the challenges with AI. We have to make monitor and make sure that it's, doesn't have any biases and I'm, I'm excited to learn with our families and, and how to do that.
[00:20:04] Ariadne: I mean, that sounds awesome. I'm excited to see it. I might go test it out after this conversation.
[00:20:10] Jean: I'll send you a, I'll send you a code, but yeah, starting in April, I believe. And I'll double check with our engineers, but we will be, if you got in, like, it'll just go ahead and make you have a free plan, a family plan.
[00:20:20] So but if it doesn't do that, send me an email and I'll, I'll give you a code.
[00:20:24] Ariadne: I am curious to see or hear where you do think the industry is going. I mean, obviously you have a lot of experience from the care manager perspective now, you know, much more so from the family perspective and the tools to equip them.
[00:20:38] Like, where do you think you'll be in another 5 10 years?
[00:20:42] Jean: I, you know, it's, it's been interesting cause I have this you see the, like, kind of like, to me, I don't like it right now. Cause I feel like it's like us versus them, you know, families versus doctors and nurses, or, you know, like the, the care staff, like, and, and that upsets me because it's like, at the end of the day, we all want the same thing for the patient.
[00:21:00] And so for me, like, I think what's happening is I'm seeing a lot of trends that are, we are pushing so much on our family's plate. And back into that home. And we've given them really no resources or tools other than a binder and, and figure it out on your own. And so those trends, you know, what I think about is we're gonna have more aging people in our community than we ever have before.
[00:21:23] So now we're gonna have more healthy people. Interacting with our health care system, seeing the brokenness and breakdowns that are going to be demanding better things because they have the wherewithal to demand those things. They, they can Venmo money to, you know, somebody, they can up, you know, sign up for something here, but when they get into health care, they're like, Oh, okay.
[00:21:43] I have to fax it. It's, it's kind of like eye opening for our family. So, so I think more people, cause sometimes it's just too late and that person's so sick, they really can't advocate or demand better. Like, I think that trend is going to impact better and, and change in our, in our health care system.
[00:21:59] The other big change that I'm seeing is the staffing crisis in a lot of areas. You know, there's just not enough social workers. There's not enough nurses. And there's a very team based, like we're trying to solve it in healthcare, but the impact on the family is when I show up, I don't get the same person.
[00:22:13] So we've lost that continuity because the best case is when you have that same person over and over and over and you build that rapport and they know you those are always the best situations. But because of all the changes around reimbursement, all the changes around staffing, Families are more and more being relied on to succinctly tell their story.
[00:22:32] And when you can do that, you get great care. And when you can't, it's kind of scary. And that's what a lot of nurses and social workers see is those gaps. And we're all trying to, you know, put Band Aids and hold it together. But those changes are really leading to this idea that I think the information has to sit with the person in some way.
[00:22:51] And given that our medically complex people often can't represent or aren't always in their, their best state of mind or health to be represent themselves is you have to think, you know, in the context of who's the person around them and family is very loosely defined in our, you know, in our company, because of.
[00:23:10] You know, the work that we do as volunteer advocates, it may be a guardian, it may be a foster system. Right. So like, how do you kind of tag and build that team. I mean, that's kind of where KayBee I was always looking at who was the most invested in that person and how do I get them involved and empowered to Advocate because as care managers, you know, it's overwhelming.
[00:23:32] We can't be there all the time, but there is someone else that we can be partnering with to make sure that both of us can stay on the same page. And so I think the biggest trend for me is this idea that more is falling in the laps of our patients and families, and we have to figure out ways to engage them to make sure that.
[00:23:47] They stay okay and they get the best care. And when they show up, they were not re you know, doing the work constantly and, and, and feeding these systems. Like we've got to get information to flow better in order to support, you know, our staff as well as our families.
[00:24:03] Ariadne: Yeah, that's super interesting. I mean, I think also independent care management is a bit of a niche, right?
[00:24:09] Like, I don't know that it's as well recognized or even accessible in a lot of places in the U.S. And I am curious, you know what you think like that will look like. Do you think it will continue growing? Or do you think more people would prefer the care manager? They get assigned through their hospital or they get assigned through their health insurance plan.
[00:24:30] Jean: I, you know, I guess I partnered with a lot of care managers out of insurance, and it's, it's interesting how it's designed on that side because it felt very phone based and not in person and so much of that independent care manager had that flexibility to be more in the home and seeing what was happening in the home.
[00:24:49] So I think there's ways to work together. For me though, like the model of the independent geriatric or the care management in general it has, the pricing has to change. I always tell people like it's either if you, so you get your assigned insurance, Or, you know, and, and that's wonderful because it's at least someone that's partnering with you and your care and helping you navigate.
[00:25:09] I think that's a great utility, but when care kind of needs, the needs are more. When I look at the choices of families, it's like 175 an hour geriatric care manager or a free binder. Like there needs to be more of a, a stabilization in between of, of choices for families. And I, I think the pricing model of around the independent is, It needs to be like changed a little bit.
[00:25:31] I I love listening and learning from other industries. And back in the day when you needed like your logo for your company, you know, you used to have to hire a graphic designer. It was an hourly thing. You had no control over the cost or how many hours it would take that person. And you get your logo.
[00:25:46] That was great. But then you had no, you know, sense of the cost of it. And so that's kind of how I see too here. It's like. You know, now, I mean, we can go hit a button and we get a price quote, and then we get a logo, right? So like, how can we not for the geriatric care management to, to help that or the care managers in general.
[00:26:04] So cause I meet tons of amazing pediatric home care nurses that would love to do it and try to figure it out. So I think there's just, there's a lot of things happening. And I think it's more, I I'm always like, it's never us versus them. It's like, okay, what can we do with the, the, the, the. The folks in the insurance and in the hospitals, you know, that are doing the work too.
[00:26:21] And how do we extend that out in the community and partner up and figure out how to work together is, is where, where my heart lies, but it's tough.
[00:26:29] Ariadne: Yeah, it's really tough. And every market is so different. Also, so like, you know, something that would work here in New York might not work in Indiana and vice versa.
[00:26:37] Exactly. So I, I did want to end with maybe advice that you would have for other nurses, social workers, people considering you know, going down the care management path or starting their own company. Like what, what, where would you recommend they start?
[00:26:54] Jean: Oh, let's see. Okay. Well, first of all, like just know, go do it.
[00:26:58] Whatever's in your head and you've been thinking about or dreaming about, like same thing, it's not until you get that first client that you really understand, wait, what am I getting myself into? What does this look like? And then you'll know, and, and you just have to keep doing it to see what's the thing that you That lights you up and that, you know, you feel like you're using all of your skills and whatnot.
[00:27:18] So you know, go do it. There are wonderful programs out there. I know there's you know, there's certain certification programs. So if you're someone that's like, I just need a little more, I feel like I need more education around how to start a business or, or, you know you know, or how do I market or how do I, you know, cause there's a skill set that we just don't have as nurses or social social workers and we don't get in, you know, from our programs.
[00:27:41] But there are wonderful programs out there. There's like board certified patient advocates.
[00:28:10] So. You know, it's finding things that make you feel like you got the credibility or the knowledge. And if that's what you need to, to go out there and try to do it, go do it.
[00:28:21] Ariadne: That's great advice. I feel like the number one thing I've come across on, you know, anything entrepreneurship related is just start, like, It doesn't matter.
[00:28:29] Jean: Same thing for our app. Like, it took us forever. We talk to a handful of families, but not until it's out in the public then do you see all the spit and spackle on your face that you need to wipe off.
[00:28:43] Like, you've got to go put an idea in someone's hands and make sure it's not your own echo chamber. Like, it's okay. Friends and family are wonderful people. They're encouraging. But if you can just strike up a random conversation and test your idea on somebody, right? Or another great tip I have is even if you don't have your own idea, like show a, a, you know, do like a competitor, right?
[00:29:06] Like if you've got, you know, like, Oh, look at this website, what do you like about it? What not? And, and see, you know, like, You know, get ideas from just them reviewing other services to see what should you be your own whatever kind of little research and ways to get out there is, is what I'm always encouraging people that have an idea, like, go do it.
[00:29:24] Ariadne: That's awesome. And if there's anyone listening that did want to get in touch or I guess, are there roles that you are looking for at Primary Records or any, any, I guess requests from the audience on your side?
[00:29:37] Jean: Yes, I, I love talking to all the independent care managers and, and the folks out there that are supporting in their community.
[00:29:44] There's a little bit of grassroots work we need to do to make sure patients can access their electronic health records. So if you love advocacy if you're trying, if you're in that space. I'm just a. I can talk to you in like a specific space of like, what software do I use as an independent person?
[00:29:55] Like would love to talk with you to see ideas that you have or needs that you have, but so just my email, I'm pretty open door though my inbox is crazy, but I will always get around to replying. It's jean at primary record. com. So especially when you're a nurse or someone and the social worker in healthcare, and this is your passion.
[00:30:13] I love, love, love talking to you.
[00:30:16] Ariadne: Well, thank you so much, Jean, for joining us today. It's been awesome
[00:30:20]